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Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?

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Ivan Dimkovic

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 17:34 - pre 227 meseci
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Ako je konkretna implementacija necega postojala PRE patentiranja patent nije validan i to ne prolazi na sudu.
Ja ne vidim kako iko moze da patentira GNU ili BSD licencirane algoritme, a da to prodje na sudu. Da MS moze da patentira ono sto je njegovo, to OK, ali patentirati desni klik misem i sl. je smesno... Da li si stvarno siguran da je pravna regulativa OK (tipican primer su sporovi Applea i Microsofta?) Kako ce MS da odbrani takav glupi patent?


Which is perfectly true... ali mi ne pricamo o MS-ovim patentima, niti o prior-art patentima - vec o patentima uopste i stavu da prodavci GPL softvera... pardon distributeri GPL sofvera ;-) nisu duzni da placaju patente ;-)

Kako se ta copyleft pricica onda translira na GPL kopiranje proizvoda Linux? :-)

Citat:
tdjokic
Patente je odbila EU a ne Toma i Bojan


Tomo tomo - hoces opet da citiram neke patente koji su savrseno registrovani u EU? ;-) Ne... nisu "softverski" - ni blizu toga ;-) Mislim, posle toliko faktualnih podataka cudi me da nisi nista skapirao, ili... je nesto drugo u pitanju? ;-)

Citat:

Pa i dalje je besplatan za svakog ko na tome nece da pravi pare. Tu je i razlika izmedju patenata i Linuxa - ovde moze svako da koristi, ali ne i da zaradjuje na tome, a tamo NIKO ne sme da koristi ako prvo ne plati!


Dokle ces demonstrirati svoju neobavestenost o patentnom sistemu? O tome da li ce se na patent placati fee ili ne odlucuje vlasnik patenta - kako i treba da bude. Ima gomila patenata koji su sasvim besplatni, i za koje postoji besplatna licenca, npr... recimo u slucaju IBM-a i mnogih drugih (MP3 je besplatan za besplatne dekodere i sl...)

Citat:

U celom svetu se priblizno jednako dobro zna i postuje, milom ili silom, sta su sve te definicije oko identiteta proizvoda i proizvojdaca, ali su ovi sa patentima bili preterali. Normalno je da ce sada poceti da se osnivaju "Skole za Linux" koje moze da otvori svako i "Linux ovlascene skole za Linux" koje ce morati da ispune odredjene uslove, sto ukljucuje i formalno obrazovanje i licence itd. i cija diploma ce vise kostati ali i vise vredeti. Necete dzabe OS? Necete ga ni imati! Xe, xe, xe.... "Cim je nesto dzabe mora da ne valja." E, sad vise nece da bude dzabe.


He he he... kako lepo, idemo svi u hor... a da malo procitamo cuvenu slobodnu GPL licencu:

http://www.gnu.org/copyleft/gpl.html

Citat:

6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on the Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from the original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject to these terms and conditions. You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein. You are not responsible for enforcing compliance by third parties to this License.


Jedno vaznije pitanje - nije li ovo dodatno ogranicavanje GPL licence - ocekujem da ce se veliki guru RMS oglasi protiv ovog blatantnog krsenja GPL licence koja kaze da se ne smeju postavljati dodatni uslovi na licencu - dakle, GPL je jasan: ako u distribuciji autor unosi bilo kakvo dodatno ogranicenje ili uslov - koji nisu propisani GPL-om... (a, to my best knowledge, trademarking nije deo GPL licence) taj softver ne moze nositi GPL licencu sa sobom i ona se smatra nistavnom.

Dakle Linus je upravo postavio novo ogranicenje u svom IPR-u - koje nije u GPL-u ;-) Ok... ime nije deo koda - nema veze, ali sta sa instancama reci "Linux" u source-kodu koji je pod GPL-om?

Ajde sad da vidimo kako se krckaju u svom sosu... ocekujem ostru reakciju FSF-a ;-)

He he he he...

[Ovu poruku je menjao Ivan Dimkovic dana 19.08.2005. u 18:46 GMT+1]
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bojan_bozovic

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 17:45 - pre 227 meseci
@ivan

uuu, da znas da si mozda u pravu... Sto u stvari uopste nije lose Ljudi ce ili da koriste *BSD ako im stvarno treba ili da skidaju MacOSX i Windows preko torenta, pa ce Linux forum biti oslobodjen pocetnickih pitanja.
 
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Palma
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 17:54 - pre 227 meseci

A ionako vas mnogo ima. :)
This time next year we will be millionaires
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 17:59 - pre 227 meseci
jbg, ako Linus uspe da ucini da Linux nije GPL (pravno, naravno) ispasce da je 10000 ljudi 10 godina radilo za njega besplatno, jos su mu i brend napravili, i sad moze da osnuje Linux Corporation i da postane novi Bil Gejts
 
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Ivan Dimkovic

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 18:11 - pre 227 meseci
Nije li zivot kucka ;-) Pitam se da li ce Linus deliti svoje pare koje zaradi od Linux(TM) sa kolegama slobodnim open-source developerima koji su mu razvili brand hehe ;)

A da da... oni su doprinosili bez ocekivanja zarade... samo nekako svi profitiraju osim njih ;-)

Nadam se da ce neko napraviti novu licencu HPL - Hypocrite Public Licence

[Ovu poruku je menjao Ivan Dimkovic dana 19.08.2005. u 19:13 GMT+1]
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tdjokic
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 19:13 - pre 227 meseci
Odo' ja da skidam FreeBSD, "Free as in ... BSD!"
Na svetu postoje samo 2 OS-a: 1. Mint, 2. svi ostali!
 
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LonghornXP
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 21:04 - pre 227 meseci
Ukoliko je ova inforamcija tačna. Linus Torvald će postati veoma bogat čovek.

Imajući u vidu da je "Linux" njegov zaštitni znak, čovek ima pravo na parče kolača kojeg dobijaju određene kompanije koje uzgrad naplaćuju svoje linux distribucije. Što znači ako te kompanije uzimaju pare za svoje linux distribucije zašto da i on ne dobije koji dolar.
 
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bojan_bozovic

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?19.08.2005. u 21:12 - pre 227 meseci
Da, a to je zakuvao Stillman sa njegovom HPL i sa 'Free as in beer' jedinstvenim objasnjenjem za pravne pojmove... Pod BSD licencom tako nesto ne moze da se desi, jer je ta odavno prosla test... Cuveni slucaj sa BSD 4.4-Encumbered i AT&T UNIX.

Otkad ja znam za Linux Linus je to registrovao kao robnu marku, i to ce biti prvi veliki test FSF GPL licence.

[Ovu poruku je menjao bojan_bozovic dana 19.08.2005. u 22:22 GMT+1]

Evo toga clanka:

Citat:
Linus backs trademark charge, says 'Maddog'
By Sam Varghese
August 19, 2005 - 1:48PM
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Trademarking the Linux name and charging for its commercial use world-wide is supported by its creator Linus Torvalds, a senior Linux community figure from the US says.

A recent letter sent to nearly 90 Australian companies, demanding payment of a sub-licence fee that can range from $A200 to $A5000 for use of the Linux name, caused considerable confusion and prompted speculation the fee was a scam.

But in an attempt to clarify the situation in Australia, Jon 'Maddog' Hall, the executive director of Linux International in the US, said a community organisation called Linux Australia had been nominated to handle the trademark issue in this country.

The Linux Mark Institute (LMI) handles trademark issues in the US. In other countries it nominates local bodies to look after things, he said.

Linux is a popular, free open-source operating system that runs on a number of hardware platforms, including PCs and Macintoshes.
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Hall said while Torvalds and the LMI did not object to people using the Linux name for legitimate purposes, there were some who tried to limit or block other peoples' business by creating bogus trademark registries.

"We are not blocking anyone's business. If there is a single business out there that is blocked by this issue, please have them contact me," he said.

When asked how open source advocates could fight against the legitimising of software patents and yet charge fees for a trademark, Mr Hall said you couldn't create a product covered by a patent unless you licences it; with a trademark you could change the name and still sell the product.

"You certainly could create and distribute a useful product without having 'Linux' in the trademarked name," he said. "Debian comes to mind. Red Hat Software is another."

Linux Australia president Jonathan Oxer said while patents could stop people from doing the same thing, such as writing a piece of software that was functionally equivalent, trademarks regulated people who wanted to use an identity. "In effect, it's a measure to prevent identity theft," he said.

"Patents can be anti-competitive (or at least anti-productive) in the software world by preventing other people competing on a level playing field. They are specifically intended to grant a limited monopoly."

Oxer said trademarks did not prevent fair competition. "They don't stop anyone else going into business and doing the exact same thing as an existing company. What they do prevent is someone stealing the name of an existing product or company and then using that name to their benefit."

Hall said while the LMI could, in some cases, refuse to grant a sub-licence for use of the name, Torvalds had the final say.

"He is the owner of the mark, it is his name. But my experience has been that Linus views this as him holding the mark for the community," he said.

The highest fee in the US is $US5000. "While to some the $US5000 fee may seem like a lot to pay on $US1 million of revenue, we point out that it is only on the revenue generated by the trademarked product, not the whole company (unless the whole company is called 'Linux XXXXXXX'), and there is no upper limit to the revenue that could be made," Hall said.

"We are not trying to limit the use of the name Linux. We are only asking that people help us protect the quality of the Linux name, and ultimately their trademark by both giving proper attribution (everyone) and by helping us fund the cause (the actual sub-licence holders)," he said.


[Ovu poruku je menjao bojan_bozovic dana 19.08.2005. u 22:38 GMT+1]
 
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degojs

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 00:26 - pre 227 meseci
Možda će onaj siroma' Pat Slackware da stavi prst na čelo danas.

Doduše, trač je i da je vest lažna :) Znaće se vrlo brzo.

[Ovu poruku je menjao degojs dana 20.08.2005. u 01:32 GMT+1]
Commercial-Free !!!
 
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 00:48 - pre 227 meseci
Citat:
tdjokic: Odo' ja da skidam FreeBSD, "Free as in ... BSD!"


Vec ucinjeno Ako je ovo istina, odma da se prebacim
"The world holds two classes of men - intelligent men without religion, and religious men without intelligence."
 
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 00:50 - pre 227 meseci
http://www.linuxmark.org/
 
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 01:24 - pre 227 meseci
Hehe, prodao se za sitne pare:

http://www.linuxmark.org/fees.html

[Ovu poruku je menjao Dragi Tata dana 20.08.2005. u 02:24 GMT+1]
 
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 01:25 - pre 227 meseci
Toliko o toj ideologiji da je sve dzabe, nista u svetu nije dzabe i niko nista ne daje za dzabe vec iz nekog interesa.
 
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 01:32 - pre 227 meseci
Citat:
WHO WE ARE:
As stated in our articles of incorporation, The Linux Mark Institute ("LMI") is an organization established "to protect the public and Linux® users of the world from unauthorized and confusing use of the Linux mark and to issue proper licenses to authorized users of the Linux mark." LMI is not designed to generate profits for anyone, which is why Linus Torvalds has given LMI primary sub-license rights for the mark. We work to protect legitimate uses of the LINUX trademark without burdening Linus Torvalds or any one entity with the financial responsibility of protecting the LINUX community's use of the mark.

"The world holds two classes of men - intelligent men without religion, and religious men without intelligence."
 
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 01:37 - pre 227 meseci
"Sliding Scale.


An Annual Fee is applied to each sublicensed trademark. The fee is set according to two factors: A) the for profit/non-profit status of your company or organization, and B) the aggregate gross revenue you expect to earn in the next fiscal year for goods/services associated with the mark in question. Marks grouped in a brand are treated as a single mark.



Non-Profit Tier
Annual Fee = US$200
For Profit/Other Tier 1

[This is a "grandfather clause" for written sublicenses executed prior to August 1, 2004]
Annual Fee = $0
For Profit/Other Tier 2

[Total projected annual gross revenue between zero and US $100,000]
Annual Fee = US $200
For Profit/Other Tier 3

[Total projected annual gross revenue between US $100,000 and US$200,000]
Annual Fee = US $500

For Profit/Other Tier 4

[Total projected annual gross revenue between US $200,000 and US $1 million]
Annual Fee = US $1000
For Profit/Other Tier 5


[Total projected annual gross revenue over US $1 million]
Annual Fee = US $5000"



 
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bojan_bozovic

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 01:49 - pre 227 meseci
'ispipava' se ovime, za par godina Linus moze i da udesetostuci to
 
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Ivan Dimkovic

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 09:35 - pre 227 meseci
Wow... 0.5% revenue tax ;-))) Hebote, ove cifre se ne bi stideli ni mnogi patent holderi.

Linus je odradio vrlo lep poslic ;-) Hehe - nisam ni sumnjao da ce to da objasne kao "neprofitne napore da se zastiti kvalitet robne marke Linuxa" - bas me zanima koliko ze gpl borgica da prihvati ovo... ;-)

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 11:28 - pre 227 meseci
U bre degojs, 'de pomenu Peta Slekvera, da znas da mi je malo tesko covek je upropastio svoj zivot zbog Linuxa (TM)* deset godina samo pacuje sors kompajrira i pravi pakete



* Linux is registered trademark of Linus Torvalds

http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/s...h/0,2000061733,39205211,00.htm
http://linux.slashdot.org/arti...=05/08/15/2149225&from=rss

Da, da, da ima da tuzi Linus i ako imate sajt 'linux.example.com'
vesti samo pristizu

[Ovu poruku je menjao bojan_bozovic dana 20.08.2005. u 13:23 GMT+1]
 
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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 12:22 - pre 227 meseci
Citat:
bojan_bozovic:
jbg, ako Linus uspe da ucini da Linux nije GPL (pravno, naravno) ispasce da je 10000 ljudi 10 godina radilo za njega besplatno, jos su mu i brend napravili, i sad moze da osnuje Linux Corporation i da postane novi Bil Gejts


koliko ja znam... da menja licencu... treba ili da napise linux iz pocetke.. ne-koristeci 'ni jednu' liniju iz postojeceg linuxa (kernela)... ili da se svih 10K+ autora linuxa slaze sa menjanjem licence... I koliko ja znam ljudi.. koji rade na kernelu.. .. ona prva varianta je laksa :)
Bolje ispasti glup nego iz aviona
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bojan_bozovic

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icon Re: Linus Torvalds naplaćuje ime Linux?20.08.2005. u 12:26 - pre 227 meseci
Nesto si pobrkao, mulaz, citaj odpocetka, moguce je da Linux (TM) nikad nije ni bio GPL samo nismo citali ono sto pise malim slovima To ce pravnici da kazu a ne developeri a sto se robne marke tice, budala od Stillmana to nije zabranila u GPL pa to eto vidis moze da se uradi.. To ne mogu ja da kazem, to ne mozes ni ti da kazes, to ce sud da presudi... A siguran sam da je Linus vec platio advokate i od njih zatrazio savet kako da postupa...

 
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