[es] - retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

ranikolahdd
Beograd

Član broj: 25262
Poruke: 958
*.saix.net.

Sajt: www.spasavanjepodataka.rs

+51 Profil

^{17.04.2005. u 00:01 - pre 231 meseci}

''friz pomaze kod mehanike''

http://www.elitesecurity.org/tema/62364/0#401021

''Problem je prasina koja se nalazi u vazduhu i dovoljna je da unisti povrsinu diska... ESD koji se javlja nakon toga je sam po sebi dovoljan da unisti podatke koji nisu mehanicki unisteni....

Za otvaranje HHD-a je potrebna cista soba klase 100 (ako se dobro secam) sa HVAC filterima. Pored toga, neki diskovi zahtevaju odredjeni podprtitisak da bi glave mogle da se krecu po pravoj putanji (Bernuli) ... U svakom slucaju ne treba otvarati diskove.. :) Inace, jedan od cescih problema je da disk nece da se zavrti jer je doslo do termicke deformacije na rukavcu nosaca diskova (obzirom da je motor direktno vezan na diskove i male je snage dovoljne su male deformacije da se prolem javi)...

Za one koji bi da prave cistu sobu, samo paket vlaznih maramica za ciscenje u cistoj sobi kosta 140$ :) o stolovima i filterima da ne pricam ...''

http://www.elitesecurity.org/tema/14449/0#103745

''Ocigledno da ne razumes o cemu pricam :) Postoje diskovi kod kojih se lezaj koji drzi ploce posle izvesnog vremena zaglavi i ne moze se dovoljo lako pokrenuti. Tada, se snizavanjem temperature samo vratilo skupi proporcionalno vise od lezaja (koje je od npr aluminijumske bronze) i dovoljno je par 0,01mm da se disk normalno pokrene.

Inace, to je standardna procedura :) ''
http://www.elitesecurity.org/tema/48299/0#332350

to be continued

spasavanje podataka
Datarecovery master

Odgovor na temu

Goran Mijailovic

Član broj: 12684
Poruke: 6907

+437 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 00:38 - pre 231 meseci}

Citat:

ranikolahdd: ''friz pomaze kod mehanike''...

Ima ljudi kojima je ta "tehnika" pomogla po njihovom sopstvenom priznanju, mozes naci i ovde kao i vani ljude sa takvim "iskustvom" da li su svi ti ljudi lazovi?

Citat:

Freezer trick worked

eheh, good story...
actually I'm one of the guys who tried that hdd-in-a-freezer trick too and
it worked! the disk made funny noices and the bios said "no disk here, man".
listening to the repetetive noise I could tell it was a mechanical failure.
so I put the disk in a plastic box and left in the fridge for some time.
then I took it out and quickly connected (you don't want it to reach the
room temperature) to my pc. the bios welcomed the drive and i recovered
90Megs of data, i.e. everything stored on that disk. the explanation to that
was that the low temperature causes the mechanical parts of the disk to
shrink and everyting is "in its place" till the disk warms up. thus you gain
some time to get the data back...

I wonder if there's any data recovery method involving boiling the disk...

http://www.deadharddrive.com/stories.html

Citat:

How to fix a hard disk

So I do some searching on Google. I turn up lots of sketchy info about how other people have fixed hard drives. I even try some of them.

One of my favourites - put the hard drive in a plastic bag and put it in the freezer - cooling it down shrinks the parts and may enable the drive to spin up properly. I actually try this and get lots of funny looks from my wife. Still, it doesn't work.

Evo njemu nije uspelo, a naravno da nije kad mu je crkla elektronika sto se vidi iz njegovog kasnijeg pisanja, ali kao sto vidis taj trik sa zamrzivacem nije nasa izmisljotina. Ne vidim razlog zasto nesto odbacivati a priori.

http://www.deadharddrive.com/

Odgovor na temu

McKracken
Vladimir Jovanovic
HuxleyDev

Član broj: 465
Poruke: 2941
*.sattvmeteor.co.yu.

ICQ: 203079925

+7 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 00:42 - pre 231 meseci}

Posto vidim da te nije mrzelo da vadis moje stare poruke, cisto da upitam jel to opet oces da izazivas flame?

Odgovor na temu

Goran Mijailovic

Član broj: 12684
Poruke: 6907

+437 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 00:47 - pre 231 meseci}

lepo ti je McKraken rekao u onoj temi sto si dao link:

Citat:

Radio sam to barem 10 puta i imalo je efekta (na razlicitim diskovima).

Citat:

Ocigledno da ne razumes o cemu pricam :) Postoje diskovi kod kojih se lezaj koji drzi ploce posle izvesnog vremena zaglavi i ne moze se dovoljo lako pokrenuti. Tada, se snizavanjem temperature samo vratilo skupi proporcionalno vise od lezaja (koje je od npr aluminijumske bronze) i dovoljno je par 0,01mm da se disk normalno pokrene.

Citat:

Sta hocu da kazem:

- Stvar na koju su nakacen ploce (diskovi) ze zove vratilo (jer prenosi snagu inace bi bila osovina ;)

- obzirom da mora da bude negde lezaj :) makar on bio i viskozni, desi se da taj lezaj posle nekog vremena zakaze.

Evo o cemu pricam:
http://www.taylor-hobson.com/images/hard_disc_drive.gif

ono u sredini je vratilo :)

Prikačeni fajlovi

hard_disc_drive.gif - 6.7k

Odgovor na temu

Goran Mijailovic

Član broj: 12684
Poruke: 6907

+437 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 00:52 - pre 231 meseci}

A sto se tice ciste sobe :) evo savet kako da je napravite kod kuce i jos po nesto:

Citat:

Created his own cleanroom in his bathroom!

Well, I've got a story for you...

So I had a server with 2, 20 gig, Maxtor hard disks in it in a software
mirror. I was running RedHat Linux 6.2 with a custom kernel. Having
recently moved my office, I decided to clean up the office. I took the
Rsync mirror (an old hodgepodge machine with 5 disks striped together to
be enough space for the data) and started rebuilding it. Having just
purchased 2 new spare Matrox disks of the same model as the ones in the
server I decided to use them as the data partition and use one of the
striped disks as the system.

So, here I was with my rsync machine half installed on one of the disks
that was the data partition of it and I got a message on my pager.
Stopping for a second to read the page I immediately felt my stomach
collapse. One of the disks had fallen out of the mirror set on the
production server. So, I immediately checked the status. Thankfully
Linux had started recovering the mirror for me.

So, now I'm thinking... Wow this is working grrr..... uhhh. It was at
that point that I realized the mirror recovery was synchronizing
/dev/hdg1 to /dev/hdg1. This you might understand is a bad thing.

After the panic set it I started the discovery process. It turned out
that /dev/hdg1 was completely destroyed, the filesystem was just
trashed. It had copied data from the middle of the disk to the
beginning of the disk. Also the other disk in the mirror, /dev/hde was
in fact dead. Unfortunately it would in fact spin up, it just thunked
the whole time. The dreaded sound you hate to hear.

I tried what you tried to swap the controller but the controllers were
all 4 different. In fact the since Maxtor had just purchased Quantum,
opening up the new disks (remember they were all the model numbers)
revealed that I had actually received 30 gig Quantum drives. I tried
copying data, recovering data, even using bit scrapers, nothing worked.

Trying to restore from tapes didn't work out because as it turned out,
the cabinet that backup server got set next to wasn't a cabinet. It was
an electrical transformer for the air conditioner system.

After many attempts at a lot of things, I ended up finding a
description on how to make a clean room in your own house and that's
what I ended up doing. So after all that, here it is.

I took all my tools, a bottle of bleach, some lint free rags, and sealed
myself into the bathroom. After thoroughly cleaning the bathroom with
bleach, I turned on the shower and ran it for about an hour. This
created a room full of steam. At this point you wait another half hour
for all the steam to naturally subside. Take the bleach and lint free
rags and clean off the porcelain counter. At this point I took the disk
that had crashed and the disk that had corrupted itself and pulled them
apart. I took the disk platters from the disks and swapped them.

Don't try this at home folks, if I knew what I know now I wouldn't have
done it. However, it worked. I copied the data and recovered from the
failure with a lot more knowledge about drives, backups, restoration and
operating a fault tolerant system. I also replaced the mirror set with
a hardware based mirror set on SCSI disks.

--Chris Tooley

http://www.deadharddrive.com/stories.html

Odgovor na temu

McKracken
Vladimir Jovanovic
HuxleyDev

Član broj: 465
Poruke: 2941
*.sattvmeteor.co.yu.

ICQ: 203079925

+7 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:04 - pre 231 meseci}

A evo i malo teksta od strane ljudi koji verovatno znaju ponesto o diskovima:

http://www.hitachigst.com/tech...9C4B963AEE9A6F86256D340075052F

Procitati poslednji pasus u kome se pominju termicke karakteristike lezaja.

Odgovor na temu

ranikolahdd
Beograd

Član broj: 25262
Poruke: 958
*.saix.net.

Sajt: www.spasavanjepodataka.rs

+51 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:11 - pre 231 meseci}

cekaj samo sam dao korisne linkove bez komentara
sto jel se stidite ovoga,
pre neki dan sam u potpuno prljavoj sobi zamenio glave na fujitsu-u
a dan posle na 20-gb ibm-u 2,5''.uspesno.
a sto se tice motora, samo slovima 1 wd200 ke imao motor koji je crkao, ali ne zaglavio.
inace koracni motori ne mogu da rade sporije i brze vec samo istom brzinom,nije tp sus,a i jos jedna stvar,glava nema motor.jer nema ni kompas motor.
a sto se zamrzivaca tice ljudi su mislili i da je zemlja okrugla.

spasavanje podataka
Datarecovery master

Odgovor na temu

ranikolahdd
Beograd

Član broj: 25262
Poruke: 958
*.saix.net.

Sajt: www.spasavanjepodataka.rs

+51 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:14 - pre 231 meseci}

pa i wd zna nesto o diskovima pa na wd200 stavi metal na metal kad je rec o osovini na kojoj je glava bez lezaja.
nije motor uzrok kvarova na motiru ali me interesuje koji su konkretno diskovi imali problema sa istim.

spasavanje podataka
Datarecovery master

Odgovor na temu

McKracken
Vladimir Jovanovic
HuxleyDev

Član broj: 465
Poruke: 2941
*.sattvmeteor.co.yu.

ICQ: 203079925

+7 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:17 - pre 231 meseci}

Citat:

pre neki dan sam u potpuno prljavoj sobi zamenio glave na fujitsu-u

Nadam se da je klijent znao sta mu radis sa diskom.

Nikola.. Molim te da ne brzas i skapiras sta znaci rec lezaj da ne bi imalo ovoliko sukoba.

Citat:

nije motor uzrok kvarova na motiru ali me interesuje koji su konkretno diskovi imali problema sa istim.

(cisto kao primer brzanja)

Odgovor na temu

ranikolahdd
Beograd

Član broj: 25262
Poruke: 958
*.saix.net.

Sajt: www.spasavanjepodataka.rs

+51 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:22 - pre 231 meseci}

klijent dobio podatke , platio i zadovoljan, a dal sam ga ja mrzno il topio sta ga briga.al sam siguran da u disku nije bilo podpritiska ili nadpritiska jer mi je radio na stolu 2 sata otvoren.pa sta mislis koja je tehnologija izrade kada se ploce u fabrici obelezavaju markerom,.sve lovacke price velikih kompanija nebili se uzimale pare narodu.

_{[Ovu poruku je menjao ranikolahdd dana 17.04.2005. u 02:25 GMT+1]}

spasavanje podataka
Datarecovery master

Odgovor na temu

ranikolahdd
Beograd

Član broj: 25262
Poruke: 958
*.saix.net.

Sajt: www.spasavanjepodataka.rs

+51 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:24 - pre 231 meseci}

pa dobro uzrok kvara na hdd-u nije ni u 1 promilu motor.
a ostalo nije navedeno kao primer gluposti.

spasavanje podataka
Datarecovery master

Odgovor na temu

McKracken
Vladimir Jovanovic
HuxleyDev

Član broj: 465
Poruke: 2941
*.sattvmeteor.co.yu.

ICQ: 203079925

+7 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:37 - pre 231 meseci}

http://www.dataclinic.co.uk/da...oblems-with-spindle-motors.htm

http://www.dataclinic.co.uk/da...ut-hard-disk-failure-types.htm

Odgovor na temu

ranikolahdd
Beograd

Član broj: 25262
Poruke: 958
*.saix.net.

Sajt: www.spasavanjepodataka.rs

+51 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 01:57 - pre 231 meseci}

a da oni ne lazu

spasavanje podataka
Datarecovery master

Odgovor na temu

Goran Mijailovic

Član broj: 12684
Poruke: 6907

+437 Profil

Re: retro,istorija popravke hdd-ova

^{17.04.2005. u 12:41 - pre 231 meseci}

Citat:

ranikolahdd: pa i wd zna nesto o diskovima pa na wd200 stavi metal na metal...

Pa sta, turbo punjac (turbosarzer, turbo kompresor) na dizel motorima okrece i preko 10000 obrtaja pa mu je lezaj izradjen od specijalne vrste bronze.

Evo na primer:

Citat:

On funkcioniše kao veoma brzi propeler tj. impeler (propeler koji ima obratnu funkciju) usisavajući vazduh u sredinu kompresora, a izbacujući ga po obodu impelera koji se okreće na velikim brzinama (preko 40000 obrtaja u minuti).

http://www.nacionalnaklasa.com/PrintArticle520.phtml

Odgovor na temu